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Member Since: 25-Nov-09
Location: NZ
Posts: 1136
Forum Level:
A Thinker
US Politics
I could write a novel on this but I won't

Your country is stuffed because of now your three branches of Government operate.

The Judicial is not independent. The appointment of Federal & Supreme Court Judges for life by the Executive branch is stupid. The Judges need to be appointed by an independent body.

If the same party holds the Presidency as well as the Senate, then the appointment will go through. If the Senate is held by an opposing party, the appointment won't. Because of this the Judge's (not always, but mostly) appear to follow the respective party's view in cases. They are not independent. It's that simple.

The Legislative branch runs into problems when differing parties control different houses. If one person can control what potential legislation is to be brought to the floor then that person controls the whole process. You might as well have only one house. More will happen, quicker & faster.

As for the Executive / Presidency, regardless of your politics and which party has the Presidency, they can act like a King through Executive Orders.

Then there are the respective committees each House & Senate have. How can the Executive refuse to attend, answer questions or produce documents. What would happen to a 'normal' US citizen who did that. They would be incomtempt. Yet the Executive can. It does not make sense. Some may say the information is to sensitive, but, you have processes for that: i.e.: closed hearings.

If the checks and balances in the Judicial and Legislative branches are not working you have an authoritarian executive.

Then you have a hang up about the word Socialism.

Socialism is not communism. It seems to me that the right political parties in the US use this as a boogey man every time they talk about someone with "liberal" ideas and "liberal" ideas are not all wrong.

People would say NZ is a socialist country, maybe, we have a reasonable welfare net established through bloody sweat & tears. Which mostly have been kept in place by either Governments be they "centre-right" or centre-left". For example, National Superannuation is guaranteed to everyone over 65, regardless of whether you need it or not. But we are a capitalist country. And yet the two can co-exist as the same time.

As for how your country was in the 50s / 60s you have to realise that because of WW2, the US was the only country left with funds or a manufacturing base. Therefore most trade was US (there is a generalisation here). That has changed and the US is no longer the main player, as it would never have been had it been effected by WW2 as Europe & Asia were.

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Member Since: 12-Oct-13
Location: US
Posts: 1570
Forum Level:
Active Contributor
It's called checks and balances. It's also called democracy. It's just a different form from yours. And it's worked for us for over 230 years. It's not perfect, but neither is your own form of government. No form of government is perfect.

You're completely wrong on our judiciary. Our judiciary is independent. If you actually read up on how the Supreme Court operates, as well as how our Federal and state courts operate, they're all independent, and often make decisions that overturn Congressional and State Legislature laws, as well as regulations.

As happened with gay marriage here -- it was introduced as law in many states by vote, and in many states by court decisions, both Federal and State. Obamacare was backed in part by a largely conservative Supreme Court, even though the law itself was a product of our liberally minded party.

Federal and State Justices aren't political robots, as a modest perusal of some Court decisions would illustrate.

You're correct in that the US is not the main player anymore. China has more economic influence on your part of the world than we do. And when they build their navy up to oceanic status, they will also have more of a military influence in your part of the world as well.

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Member Since: 7-Apr-05
Location: GB
Posts: 59292
Forum Level:
Handle Me With Care
Trumpet has a clever team behind him now..
Needs to have because of what he is.

To keep control of The U.S.A and with no sign of Tantrum Trumpet quitting, They are very much needed by The Party..

Seems that Trump reads out prepared speeches from them now...sometimes.

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Member Since: 22-Apr-06
Location: GB
Posts: 554
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Just getting started
It always amuses me how so many people outside the US have opinions on US politics and become so obsessed with it. As a non US citizen whatever you think is really pretty irrelevant as you have no influence over what happens there whatsoever. I'm not a US citizen either but I do visit there a lot, have many friends there and think it's a great place, but guess what, I don't concern myself with US politics because it's none of my business.

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Member Since: 7-Apr-05
Location: GB
Posts: 59292
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Handle Me With Care
sidders73 said: It always amuses me how so many people outside the US have opinions on US politics and become so obsessed with it. As a non US citizen whatever you think is really pretty irrelevant as you have no influence over what happens there whatsoever. I'm not a US citizen either but I do visit there a lot, have many friends there and think it's a great place, but guess what, I don't concern myself with US politics because it's none of my business.


Good points there, however Trump is messing with world politics as he is the most powerfull human spokesperson on earth.

Trumpet is playing with us as well (uk)

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Member Since: 22-Apr-06
Location: GB
Posts: 554
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Just getting started
Despite it being unfashionable, I actually quite like the man.

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Member Since: 23-Sep-03
Location: US
Posts: 2295
Forum Level:
Active Contributor
I think it really comes down to our country is stuffed because we have decided that politics should be for sale; or rather it was orchestrated that our politics should be for sale and we didn't have the wherewithal to oppose it.

A great book going into this is Democracy in Chains. It details in pretty good depth the half century plus long effort that has resulted in today. I get the feeling that the success of the effort is likely to be duplicated in a world in which capital and power can flow so much more freely than people can, so worth reading wherever IMHO.

But I would say two unique factors that plays into it here is

1) Media ownership in America is ludicrous. It is astonishingly hegemonic for a country that pays such lip service to "freedom and independence of speech" being a fundamental pillar of a healthy society. To me, this sets up a "chicken or the egg" scenario. Did America's penchant for unfettered capitalism lead to this media environment and propaganda or did the media environment and propaganda lead to the penchant for unfettered capitalism?

2) Leading the "fight" in the cold war in such a militarized fashion made it easy to demonize anything and everything to the left of center...and even the center at times. Clinton, Gore, Kerry, Obama, Clinton and now all 20 or so candidates vying for the Dem nomination are called and ***believed*** to be effectively communists by at least a third of our population. Even John Delaney would get called a socialist by them for God's sake.

Personally, I think the whole, "People who don't live there shouldn't voice opinions" is stupid. Having ideas be challenged is always a good thing, IMO, unless you are scared to have your ideas challenged. There is a world of thought and information out there, not just one nation of thought and information.

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Member Since: 23-Sep-03
Location: US
Posts: 2295
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Active Contributor
Raven2005 said: Trumpet has a clever team behind him now..
Needs to have because of what he is.

To keep control of The U.S.A and with no sign of Tantrum Trumpet quitting, They are very much needed by The Party..

Seems that Trump reads out prepared speeches from them now...sometimes.


The true power players behind him who have been making clever choices have never been...and are not now...in the public view. It is not a coincidence that for some strange reason "draining the swamp" ends up with a bunch of the same people who have been involved at the highest levels of finance, donors, politics, corporations and lobbyists as during previous administrations running the same things.

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Member Since: 7-Jan-19
Location: GB
Posts: 1269
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Active Contributor
Perception vs Reality?

My perception of US politics is pretty much the same as the OP. Fortunately I don't have to live the reality. Unfortunately I have to live the reality of UK politics.

As for voicing an opinion ......... arseholes.


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Member Since: 12-Oct-13
Location: US
Posts: 1570
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dziga said: I think it really comes down to our country is stuffed because we have decided that politics should be for sale; or rather it was orchestrated that our politics should be for sale and we didn't have the wherewithal to oppose it.

[snip]

1) Media ownership in America is ludicrous. It is astonishingly hegemonic for a country that pays such lip service to "freedom and independence of speech" being a fundamental pillar of a healthy society. To me, this sets up a "chicken or the egg" scenario. Did America's penchant for unfettered capitalism lead to this media environment and propaganda or did the media environment and propaganda lead to the penchant for unfettered capitalism?


Politics is for sale everywhere. It's one of the unfortunate facts of democracy. If it isn't for sale while they are running for office, it's for sale after they get into office. It's also for sale within political parties. Try running as an outsider, without the benefit of belonging to a political party. In most countries it's fairly rare. I think Macron is the biggest recent exception. In most democracies, the parties have a stranglehold on politics, and they hold the purse strings as well.

Media ownership nearly everywhere is problematic. In China, for example, it's tightly controlled. But certain forms of control are not limited to countries like China.

In many democratic countries, it's controlled through other means, be it shadow banning of certain information sources, banning of certain individuals from speaking in your country, publishers induced by moneyed interests (domestic or foreign) to not publish certain books or articles critical of government or certain government officials, or concentrated ownership of major news and other mass media by a government, or a limited number of corporate entities controlling key news and entertainment media.

You can see varying elements of this trend in nearly every Western country. The internet has altered some of it, but not completely.

As for your question of Americans seemingly preferring unfettered capitalism, it's a long tradition that goes back to the founding of the country. Our entire history is filled with the concept. It isn't just a product of the 20th and 21st Centuries.

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Member Since: 8-Aug-05
Location: SE
Posts: 5300
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Active Contributor
sidders73 said: It always amuses me how so many people outside the US have opinions on US politics and become so obsessed with it. As a non US citizen whatever you think is really pretty irrelevant as you have no influence over what happens there whatsoever. I'm not a US citizen either but I do visit there a lot, have many friends there and think it's a great place, but guess what, I don't concern myself with US politics because it's none of my business.

Thumper is taking US politics worldwide
meddeling in every countries business
Have can anyone NOT notice him?
Hes an elephant in a china store
everybody sees him breaking stuff
They are just waiting for the big Bang!

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Member Since: 7-Jan-19
Location: GB
Posts: 1269
Forum Level:
Active Contributor
Artistic said:
sidders73 said: It always amuses me how so many people outside the US have opinions on US politics and become so obsessed with it. As a non US citizen whatever you think is really pretty irrelevant as you have no influence over what happens there whatsoever. I'm not a US citizen either but I do visit there a lot, have many friends there and think it's a great place, but guess what, I don't concern myself with US politics because it's none of my business.

Thumper is taking US politics worldwide
meddeling in every countries business
Have can anyone NOT notice him?
Hes an elephant in a china store
everybody sees him breaking stuff
They are just waiting for the big Bang!


I couldn't agree more Arti. It's time Mexico paid for the sodding wall to keep that excuse for a human being in the good ole USA. The joke is wearing thin now.

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